So I am not sure how many people have see the powerpoint presentation aimed at developers regards Version 5.
2 Things stuck out to me
They are still using cursors to communicate with the SQL backend. My understanding (not too deep mind) is that this is one of the main performace problems. I am confident that if MBS can overcome performance with Nav and SQL it would wipe the market place for ERP solutions.
There will be C# used, but the developer will continue to develop in C/AL. The exact phrase is “The developer will not see the C# code” BUT does this mean we can’t change it in C# if we want?
In current versions 4.x and earlier Navision client maintained it’s own cursor, I believe with 5 it is handled at native SQL. Performance wise, I don’t know how of a difference that is. The performance problem I think mostly resides in the way the tables are structured and Posting. Most of 3 tiered systems have staging tables and overnight update the GL etc.
It creates a binary DLL file, can you modify a dll file? I guess you can write wrappers.
This is what I am guessing, I could be 100% wrong.
In next version no (my opinion). Because there must be tool to keep the application logic of C/AL code (used with the C/SIDE client) consistent with application logic published into IIS (mid-tier) used with new Dynamics client. But you can create your own client which will render the informations for the user…
If there will be way how to change the published application logic, it will be dangerous…
Okay (just trying to stir discussion more than anything [:)] ), So why bother applying the C# at all if your not going to let the developer make use of .net and CLR?
So its going C/AL → C# → SQL (I think), why not skip it all together and just give us C#
I mean its a hell of a lot more articulate than C/AL right?
The next thing would be to say, “Well the time it takes to convert Navision to C#” they must have a tool that does that if they are creating Dll’s from C# based on C/AL code???
Also that I’m not really a good developer in c#, I see several issues using C# instead of C/AL:
It takes you a week to understand how C/AL works and is being used. It will take ages to fully understand C# code instead.
Due to the limited functionality in C/AL it is not soo easy to crash your application. It is easier with C#.
But as we all know, a few more triggers in forms would be useful, so maybe we can change the base class of the form Navision is deriving their C# converted forms from to get additional functionality.
This way we would not need to change the code generated by Navision, but can still influence the behaviour of the system ?
I would guess, that the majority of Navision Developpers are not nearly as proficient using C# as using C/AL. So I think what Microsoft is trying to do is slowly forcing everybody to the new technologies, and the first step seems to be getting people to use SQL Server and it’s Reporting Services (seems to be the base for Reporting in Version 5, when I look at the ISV Briefing Powerpoint).
Why bother with C# at all? Well looks like they have rewritten the whole application in that language. Probably makes it easier for Microsoft to maintain and enhance NAV.
I downloaded C# express edition. Read a Microsost produced guide on how to write applications in C#. Within 3 hours I had written my own internet explorer, a fully functional rich text editor and an application pulling data off a web service.
I must admit to being a converty. It really is easy to use and understand!
As they say in the Dr. Pepper advert “Try it, you might like it” [;)]
Or as the other Dr. Pepper tagline goes*: What’s the worst that could happen*? [:D]
But seriously, when did you move to Aukland? How’s it going there?
Where did you download C# Express Edition from? With the enhancements to V5, and the greater integration to core Microsoft solutions, I think I need to sharpen the saw and I think this is going to have to be done in my own time. [:(]
The aproach being taken makes a lot of sense. It’s most important to keep in mind that Navision is first and foremost a business application, its not a development language. The investment in that business application is in the design of the ssytem, and the C/SIDE that it is developed in. To suddenly change to a scenario where overnight there are 3 million Navision deelopers that have no idea about the business logic would be a very dangerous thing. C/SIDE gives you a business/Navision approach to the application, and allows you to study and work with the business logic, rather than being a coder.
Many business people, accountants etc. have become very good C/SIDE developers, and thus develop great Navision applications. I can not see a wave of Accountants going out to learn C# just to add one field to a table and display it on a form.
The approach taken is very sensible and is good for the whole Navision community.
I often wondered how many Navision developer are out there. Also you included end users as developers. Based on number of installation of navision about 55K and about average users per client be 20 users. you’ll get 1.1 million users. I don’t think there more developers than navision users.
Actually Dynamics NAV just recently sold its millionth user (in February I think), they announced this at the MVP seminar n Cambridge. But those are only end users, not developers. I know my spelling in the last post was bad, but what I said still stands. i.e. that to suddenly overnight say that every C# programmer in the world is now a Navision developer just deos not make any sense what so ever. Of course I have no idea how many C# developers there are in the world, and probably there are a lot more than the random numebr of 3 million that I just said.
I believe its still free, you might wanna make sure you get the SQL Server Express 2005 as well, that way you can play with on your on machine. If not you can connect to a full blown SQL Server. Express is designed to replace MSDE.
There should also be a PDF around for learning how to program in C#, if not let me know and I’ll email it to you. In fact if anyone wants the PDF let me know, its good fun to play with
One thing is clear that for us C/AL developer, we need to learn C# ASAP. Otherwise, once NAV is changed to C#, more and more C# developers will raise the competitions in the job market. As for our career development, we will face two choices at that time:
learn C# and stay
move to other area
We cannot say it is good or bad to us. But according to history, if Microsoft wants to do something, they will make it successful using its huge power. Then Microsoft may become a giant in ERP market too.
