NAV 2009

Business Central/NAV User Forum
1

I have posted this elsewhere but think this may be the better area to ask the question.

As a potential new implementer of NAV, I have the perennial issue of a tight implementation schedule. As I cannot delay the project until the new NAV version is available, I am likely to start the project in September using 2005, then upgrade to version 2009 in November during the project.Whilst this sounds like a nightmare it may not be too disruptive depending on how the front end has changed. Certainly less disruptive than after going live!Has anyone any good links to NAV 2009 front end demo’s so I can see the differences?

2

Take a look here https://mbs.microsoft.com/partnersource/products/navision/2009.htm.

Theres a downloadable virtual machine with the latest CTP

Ian

3

Thanks imurphy, I’ll take a look.

4

Just been trying to resurrect my passport account only to find the mbs prefixed site is for people higher up the Microsoft food chain than I am. This means I cannot get a look at the 2009 version from your link. Thanks anyway.

I have however talked to Microsoft and have had confirmation that 2009 is still due for release 1st week of November and not 1st quarter of 2009 as some are reporting.

Also there may be an option for starting a project with a post beta release of this prior to this date. I will update of this should prove possible.

5

Your passport account may not have access but if you work for a partner then someone in the company has a passport account (its obligatory to get licenses as far as I know). They can either do the download for you or they can associate your account. Associating an account is rather a cumbersome process and can mean getting mbssupport involved but it can be done. This is what we did. My partner here in the company handled the signup process with MS so he used his personal passport account which was associated with the company account on MS somewhere or other. He then associated me with the company so I could use partnersource. Ian

6

As a potential end user (manufacturing) I don’t think we count as a partner!

I have talked to the supplier of NAV and they have a demo they can show me but they cannot let me have a copy.

It does seem ironic that I am proposing to spend a large amount of money on a product that I am not allowed to see or test in some way.

Bit like giving Fiat a load of money and hoping for a Dino but risking taking delivery of a Multipla.

7

The standard line is that only partners have access and your partner is bound by that - however sales is sales, everything is negotiable.

If you are a potential new client then your partner should be able to speak with their MS account manager and get permission to let you have a ctp copy - you may have to sign an NDA but this is not something I would see as being a major problem, after all we’re talking about something which will be on the market in a couple of months.

8

Becasue of NDA it is actually pretty hard to give you any proper answers here. But let me try.

Firstly I absolutely would NOT recommend what you are suggesting. Your partner should by this point in time have strongly recomended against this process, and if not, then I would seriously question their motives. The product is not yet released because it is not inalized, therefore what we are seeing right now is a beta product It is quite likely to change by the time it hits the streets.

Also traditionally (sorry due to NDA I can not say more here) the upgrade tool kits are never released at the same time as a new version, that normally follows six months or so after product release. So there will not be any method of getting your 5.00 system upgraded in November to 2009. I would check that with your partner, because maybe the upgrade tool kit is planned to be released in November also and they know somethign that the rest of us don’t.

Generally early adopters to a new version of Navision, would start with the new version, and the implementation process, which might take 6-12 months starts form that version, so lets assume NAV 2009 is released in November, you woudl be expecting clients to go live in say May.

Now I am not saying that you wont be live on NAV 2009 in December after an upgrade of your 5.00 system that you implemented in September. i am just saying that its highly unlikely, and I would suggest you get some very strong terms in your contract with your partner if you really do expect this to be happening.

Personally my advise would be to continue as you are. i.e. implement 5.00 SP1, this is a great product, very stable and very nice to work with. Then when NAV 2009.1 or NAV 2009 SP1 comes out I would look at the upgrade path, and make a decision then to do the upgrade. Any other path and you are just asking for trouble.

Sorry if the above is not what you wanted to hear, but my whole career is based on recovering Navision systems that failed, so I do have a good idea what I am talking about.

PS why can’t you use 5.00 SP1, is there a particular feature of NAV 2009 that precludes the use of 5.00?

9

Hi David

There are 2 main reasons for looking at the latest version.

The first being that during the selection process, I have asked many functionality questions, and often had the reply- “that is available in the next release” or “that is fixed in the next release”. And before you ask, no I did not keep a list of the issues that are fixed by the next release!

Secondly I wanted to start on the version that would carry us forward for the forseeable future rather than have the issues that come from upgrading to the new version with a new front end and having to try and retrain all our staff if we move forward to 2009 later.

As far as the first issue is concerned I believe the sales rep is just trying to make a sale rather than understand how to resolve the issues. Particularly as there appears to be little functionality change in version 2009; I therefore believe now that if it can be done in 2009 it can be done in version 5.

The second issue would not arise if we were starting the project in November as I am sure we would just go with the new version and be done with it, working our way past any remaining bugs etc. However we are starting in September with a go live in May next year which means starting with version 5. The only way round this is to use a post beta version of 2009 for the first couple of months. This was suggested by Microsoft UK not by the reseller. We would not be allowed to go live on that version but we could start the training etc on that version, and then implement the full 2009 version in November.

But as you say this is all a bit over the top and the best option will be to go for the proven product where there is plenty of experience and support available. I just can’t help thinking if I was looking for a product at the moment with a view to starting the project in January, I would be disappointed that I could not even see a promotional video of what the new front end could look like for one the main contenders on my shortlist.

Version 5 is my most likely option, and you have helped me in that decision.

Thanks!

10

That I am very glad to hear. At least this way, if 2009 is not fully raedy for you, say the functionality in the first release is not complete or it does not suit you, then you alraedy have in place a solid systme and your business wont stop.

BTW what is the size of your system? How many users, and how many transactions?

Also I would just point out that I would be very cautios purchasing form a company that is not so clear on the reasoning behind the sale it is trying to make. I have seen many cases where everythign was all 100% agreed in discussions during the sales phase, but at go live time a re-read of the contract shows that many of thoes “promises” never made it into the written contract. Might I suggest that every time the partner promises somethign that you document it, otherwise you most likely will not get it after go-live.

11

My company was hoping to go to Nav 2009 but instead went ahead and went to Nav 5.0.

12

I am not looking at a large system- perhaps 50+ concurrent users. Transactions therefore not high although in manufacturing terms we are high volume low value operation.

To be fair to the reseller the 2009 option was not their suggestion- it was me exploring our options going forward. Their sales executive is no different to any other I have met from any number of ERP vendors. All their products always do everything- hence my original need to actually see the product to get past the sales smokescreen. The vendor is not proposing to look at upgrading any existing customers in the first 8-12 months of the 2009 release.

I agree with the documentation thing- this is my real concern as the scoping exercise will form the basis of the contract, and there is a lot to scope in 2 weeks. This leaves a lot of “scope” for extra charges over the following months.

Good to see I am not the only one deciding to go with the safer option of V5 sp1!

13

Thanks for clarifying this. Its great to see responsible selling from your partner.

I think you will be happy wth 5.00 SP1, its a good solid product, and will give you plenty of time to really know what you want and more importantly what you really need ou of Navision beofre getting into the new product.

One very important piece of advise though, make sure to keep customizations and modifications to the absolute minimum, don’t be tempted to add the “NAV should make me coffee from freshly ground columbian coffee beans before it reads my email and enters all the orders automatically into the system for me in the morning” customization, it will only add headaches for you down the road.

As an FYI my life is spent just fixing NAV implementations that went wrong, and a huge part of my work involves simply removing unecessary customizations.

14

Yes we are looking to limit the customisations. However we will need a lot of technical/tooling information so will need to add a lot of fields. I don’t know if that means adding anything in terms of tables. I want to keep it as standard as possible but there will be some changes inevitably.

15

from where can i get a pdf ( what is new in microsoft navision 2009)

16

@ Raju

on partnersource.

17

Hi Raju

i can give you that pdf whts new in MS NAV 2009, give me your e mail id so that i cam forward you as an attachment.

Regards,

Premjeet Singh

Techno Functional Consultant