Need a source for purchasing App. Builder

Can anyone help me find a source for purchasing the Application Builder (7200) for Navision 2.0? It’s been 2 weeks since I’ve asked our NSC for a quote and I can’t a response. I’m so sick of their, “You need us…we don’t need you” attitude and would like to find another provider in the DFW area. Our usage, of Navision, is somewhat unique and I’ve always done my own customizations, occasionally needing simple changes to some of the posting functions. However, I only have the Form and Table Designer granules and need the Application Builder as we have just purchased a another company and need to design it’s user interface. However, like I mentioned, our navision usage is somewhat unique ** and I need access to the C/AL behind these forms. I need a NSC who can provide the App. Builder granule and be a preferred choice of NSC for when I need changes made to the other areas of Navision that I want to keep secured. (i.e posting functions) I need this desperately as my company moves very quickly and need to implement this user interface. Thanks in advance. ** My company has several areas of business. We have showrooms all of the country, representing other manufactures product lines. Our showrooms also represent our manufacturing businesses that provide high-end furniture and outdoor fabrics. In many case, the Sell-to Customer IS NOT the same as the Bill-to Customer and working with G/L requires special handling.

I don’t think you can purchase new granules for version 2. Microsoft discontinued lifecycle support for 2.60 on 12/31/2005. You would need to upgrade before purchasing the application manager. Contact Microsoft for assistance in finding an NSC. Being a customer that does their own development requires a somewhat different relationship with your NSC.

Well, I’ve actually tried this already and have had no success. All I need is friggin’ license file and it really sucks that I can’t get it. I can understand the different point of views, from MS to the NSC, but for Christ’s sakes, if someone doesn’t require the programming services of a NSC, and is willing to accept liability, sell them the tools they need. Isn’t that what the “Partnership” programs are all about? Besides, I would still need to have occasional changes made to posting functions. An occasional small sale is better then no sale at all.


…our navision usage is somewhat unique **…
Originally posted by mark_brown80 - 2006 May 06 : 10:24:40

I haven’t met a customer that doesn’t think this. Everyone is unique [;)] or I wouldn’t have a job. Back to your issue. What is your real problem here? 1) You can’t get any granuales added to your license as it is not supported? If this is the case then you will probably get the same answer from any NSC (upgrade). I have seen a newer license run against a 2.01 database (ie ask for an upgraded license and see if it works against your current database - I’m sure there will be a cost change for this). I am assuming that your maintenance is up to date or you are wasting everyone’s time trying to change your license. 2) Your NSC is ignoring you. Most NSC don’t care if you are doing your own development (especially if you are paying maintenance). Microsoft should help you find a new NSC. You say that you have had no success with MBS but don’t really say if you tried to get a new license directly (you will have no luck as this isn’t the model) or tried to change NSCs (which they should help you out with).

Hi Mark, unfortunately it does sometimes happen that Navision end users have problems with their NSC. Since most of my business revolves around fixing such issues, I see it a lot. But percentage wise its only very few NSCs that are problematic. Now if what you say here is correct, (and I need to say IFF, since these things can get emotional, and there could be ore to it than we cna see), then fir sure your NSC is the source of the problem. There is no reason at all why you shouldn’t be able to purchase the required license. also take a look at this thre3ad which may save me repeating some of it here. Seriously if your NSC is not willing to take this much money from you to place a phone call or send a fax, then I would recomend finding a new NSC. Sorry I don’t understand where DFW is, where is that? Now again back to the disclaimer. To buy the Application Builder, you are going to need to be upto date on support, and you will need to buy the form, table and report designers first (two of which I guess you already have). If you are still on 2.00 with no access to a 4.00 license, then its going to be quite costly. Keep in mind though that if you purchase a 4.00 Application builder, then you can use that with 2.00 database and executables, so you don’t have to upgrade. Good luck, and keep us updated as to your progress.


You say that you have had no success with MBS but don’t really say if you tried to get a new license directly
Originally posted by chrisk - 2006 May 10 : 08:12:38

That’s exactly what I’m saying. I tried to get the license directly and/or find another NSC. However, the person I spoke with, over a week ago, admitted that he really wasn’t familiar with the Navision modules and he would be getting back in touch with me.


I am assuming that your maintenance is up to date or you are wasting everyone’s time trying to change your license.

I’m not convinced that is true when using a NSC. In last 12 months, I’ve purchased additional user licenses, as well as the OCX granule, and we haven’t been current since 1999. I will try to confirm the requirements today. I called back, yesterday, to investigate the possibility of using the 4.0 App. Builder granule. However, as I had figured, the first step is getting our maintainence up-to-date and I’m still waiting on that quote. I was supposed to have received it within an hour, but didn’t, so I’m calling back, today, with a friendly reminder.

Hi Mark, I think the real issue here, is that this is all very basic sales information that yoru NSC should have given you if not immediately over the phone, then at least via email a short time after. The status of your support contract thye should know on the spot, also the fact that you can use a 4.00 license with 2.00 no problems. Its disapointing that your NSC has taken this long to get a reply back to you, ESPECIALLY when its froma customer with check book in hand ready to hand over a fist full of dollars. I am sure that it will be easy to find another NSC that would be only too happy to take that money from you.

Here’s a quick update for anyone interested. I called Microsoft back and they put me in touch with a Partner Account Mgr in my area. She sent me several alternative NSC’s in my area so we’ll see what happens. My original NSC finally called me back to tell me that the App Builder cannot be purchased and that I need to upgrade. I’m more inclined to believe that there IS a possibility of using the 4.0 version of App. Builder w/ my older version of Navision. I just tested importing the 4.0 Cronus license into Navision 2.0 and worked just fine. Of course, I realize that doesn’t necessarily mean anything but it does give me some hope. If it’s more cost effective, I wouldn’t mind buying the latest Navision, along with it’s App Builder, if I could atleast get the App Builder to work in my current version. Upgrading would be very difficult for us right now but I think this would really help us to gradually move to the later version. I’m keeping my fingers crossed.

I finally found a source for purchasing the App Builder for 2.0. However, I noticed that their quote has an additional price that basically says, “If on enhancement plan, 16% enhancement fee applies”. So what’s the deal here? Is the “Enhancement fee” only charged when you are ON a service/maintainence plan? If so, why? Could it be because you may need additional support? It seems like this concept is backwards.


“If on enhancement plan, 16% enhancement fee applies”.
Originally posted by mark_brown80 - 2006 May 18 : 03:37:36

Hello Mark, could it be that they meant “if not on enhancement plan”? AFAIK there is an additional fee to update your license if the maintenance is not up to date. To add a granule you need to pay the maintenance (with an additional fee) to be up to date, and then you can add the granule. For the granule there wil be added maintenance, too - that’s the case here in germany. greetings Jens.

Mark, thanks for the update, and glad to hear that it is working out. I am 99.9% certain that the 4.00 Applicaiton builder will work with all earlier versions of fin.exe.

ISSUE RESOLVED!! YES, the 4.0 App. Builder works in version 2.0! Total cost $8000 I DID NOT HAVE TO PAY A 16% EHANCEMENT FEE!! This is a VERY debatable topic, even in the MS organization. I spoke with MBS folks who said one thing, Area Managers who said another thing, and I saw two conflicting documents that MS had sent out explaining the “correct” information. The final answer was that IF YOU ARE NOT ON A SERVICE PLAN, YOU DO NOT INCUR THE ADDITIONAL CHARGE. (I’m only referring to Navision. I don’t know about Great Plains or others.) Thanks again for everyone’s suggestions.